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OK Pat, But I Did Compare the Aliantes vs The Paradigm.

Posted by thetubeguy1954 (A) on November 21, 2006 at 11:36:55

In Reply to: Re: Yes, I have heard 47 Labs and you haven't. posted by Pat D on November 21, 2006 at 09:32:10:

Pat,

You state that room effects dominate below 300-400 Hz or so. I don't know if that's the correct frequency or not when room effects dominate.

TG54 From what I've read, I'd state when put simply: The basic rule for sound dispersion is that those sound frequencies with wavelengths longer than their source diaphragm spread out in all directions, whereas frequencies with shorter wavelengths than the diaphragm are beamed forward. Because low frequencies always have relatively long wavelengths, their sound will almost always spread out evenly in every direction. (The only real exceptions are with dipole panel speakers and full-range horns, both of which are relatively rare special cases.) and The basic rule for rooms is that the boundaries -- walls, ceiling, and floor -- will either absorb or reflect the soundwaves that strike them. The ratio of reflection to absorption will vary according to a number of factors, from the type of surface covering to the way the room was built. The reflection ratio will be much higher at low than at higher frequencies. But whether this starts at 300-400Hz or lower I don't know.
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Next Pat you stated: In this case, the speakers were in fairly good sized rooms well away from the walls, as I said, so the acoustics were similar.

TG54 So from what you say, I take it you have your speakers setup in a fairly good sized room, well away from the walls and with acoustics that were very similar to a dealers showroom? Care to define your rooms dimensions? I'd like to know what you consider a fairly good sized room to be. I find it a fairly interesting thing that you believe the acoustics were similar considering how poorly most dealers showrooms sound.
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This does not necessarily mean they will sound the same in the room at home.

TG54 Pat it's almost an absolute certainty they will not sound the same in the room at home as they did in a dealers showroom. This is actually one of the most common things people complain about, i.e. just how different the component purchased sounds in their room at home as opposed to how it did in a dealers showroom. Furthermore it's very probable that your room at home is most likely differently shaped, differently sized and has different reflective/absorbative traits on the walls, ceiling and floor than the dealers showroom, etc. That I'm absolutely amazed that you believe it was relatively easy to assess what the speakers can do! You who always want verification of others claims via DBT's are claiming to be able to do easily what even Subjectivists don't claim is easy, but rather almost impossible.
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I normally expect the differences in sound between suitable SS amplifiers (or others with a low output impedance), CDPs, interconnects, and cables to be minimal.

TG54 Of course you know I disagree with that belief 100%.
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Pat stated I heard the Paradigm S2 using my tube amp. So it is probable they did not sound the same as with a SS amp. Whether you prefer tubes with them is up to you.

TG54 I'm sure it didn't sound the same on my Mastersound as it would on a solidstate amp, but so what? I, at the very least, compared the Paradigm Sig S2, to the Aliante Pinafarina Ones which are similar in design, in the same exact room, using the same exact amp, CDP and wires. So the only thing that changed were the speakers. IMHO it was a much more fair and accurate evaluation of what the 2 speakers can or cannot do. Again I say, your conclusions are suspect --- at best!
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Pat continues with I thought SF Cremona Auditor and the S2 were about equal in sound quality and sounded quite similar, within the limits of long term acoustic memory (hours). It was my audition for my purposes and with a view to spending my money, so really doesn't matter whether you think it fair or not.

TG54 Pat in the scheme of things my subjective opinions are as valid as yours. In that context my opinion that the "evaluation" of the two speakers was unfair and inaccurate matters as much as yours does. So unless you believe my Aliantes are considerably superior to the SF Cremona Auditor (which I suppose is possible, but I considered them equals of the SF Cremona Auditors) when I performed my evaluation of the Paradigm Sig S2 vs Aliante PF Ones the Alaintes were an all-around better speaker and noticeably so.
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TG54 Pat if you honestly believe that the Paradigm Sig S2 belongs in Class A (Restricted LF) which Stereophile defines "The best attainable sound for a component of it's kind, almost without practical considerations; "the least musical compromise. A Class A system is one for which you don't have to make a leap of faith to believe you are hearing the real thing." Then my friend you really do need to get out a lot more to: 1)listen to a lot of live unamplified music and 2) to audition some honest contenders for a speaker that might possibly be considered capable of musical presentation wherein you don't have to make a leap of faith to believe you are hearing the real thing. One that comes to mind is the Kharma Mini Exquisite @ $45K. Although a floorstander it's similar to the S2 in that it]s a 2-way and uses only a 1" concave diamind tweeter & a 7" ceramic mid/woofer. That speaker might honestly be a canidate for Stereophiles Class A (Restricted LF) but your Paradigm Sig S2's and my Aliantes definitely aren't! No matter what JA or any other reviewer says...

Keep enjoying the music -- Thetubeguy1954

It is impossible for a man to learn what he thinks he already knows. - Epictetus

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