In Reply to: Wow, what's this? A real technical question. posted by Silver Eared John on November 10, 2005 at 15:20:50:
"Dithering, done properly, will completely eliminate any kind of nonlinear distortion DUE TO QUANTIZATION."I'm not sure what you mean by "due to quantization"....
This statement is also too generalized. For if a dithered signal, for example, is played back with a non-OS DAC, the distortion will actually *increase*....
If one could recreate a pure, clean sine wave of just one or two bits of amplitude, then he can claim the distortion could be eliminated significantly. But try finding an actual unaltered output waveform that looks like that. (No distortion can ever be eliminated completely. Unless the signal itself is also eliminated completely.)
"It does not mask distortion, as someone says, and it does not 'partially' eliminate it"
It does indeed partially eliminate it!!! And the degree of elimination is dependent on both how the dither is implemented and the characteristic of the DAC's digital filter.
"There are, mind you, lots of other ways to get nonlinear distortions, from bad convertors, sample and holds, op amps, filters, ... so that doesn't mean all distortions go away."
So now you're saying it is *partial*....
"Oddly enough, though, that means that you can recover signals of much lower energy with dither than without, because for a low-level signal, the undithered result will be 0 0 0 0 0 0 ... and the dithered result will consist of a pattern of -1's, 0's and 1's, that do in fact contain the low-level signal to the extent possible given the noise level. And, yes, y'all can hear it, too, in the right circumstances, under the dither level."
If you change the final words to "under the raw data's least-significant bit", this above paragraph is accurate... But "in the right circumstances" and recovery of information under the LSB are *directly* related to the degree the earlier-discussed distortion is eliminated.
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Follow Ups
- Re: Wow, what's this? A real technical question. - Todd Krieger 16:49:14 11/10/05 (60)
- Y'all need to learn about the frequency domain, lad. - Silver Eared John 19:02:17 11/10/05 (59)
- Re: Y'all need to learn about the frequency domain, lad. - Todd Krieger 22:24:14 11/10/05 (58)
- Y'all trying to shift attention, eh? - Silver Eared John 23:09:13 11/10/05 (57)
- Time's Up..... - Todd Krieger 23:55:21 11/10/05 (56)
- Y'all just had to butt in with misinformation, then, eh? - Silver Eared John 11:45:58 11/11/05 (55)
- Let The Readers Determine That.... - Todd Krieger 19:43:57 11/12/05 (54)
- It's not a popularity contest, slick - Silver Eared John 19:54:15 11/12/05 (53)
- If it was... - mkuller 17:13:58 11/13/05 (52)
- Well, y'all know - Silver Eared John 17:43:09 11/13/05 (51)
- well, consarn it all, ain't it the goldarndest confoundinest - tunenut 11:14:37 11/14/05 (0)
- Well, Curl is right, you know... - mkuller 10:51:39 11/14/05 (4)
- Oh Please! - Dan Banquer 11:03:43 11/14/05 (3)
- That's the facts, Jack... - mkuller 11:34:50 11/14/05 (2)
- Re: These are the facts Mike. - Dan Banquer 11:43:08 11/14/05 (1)
- Hey Dan!!! - Todd Krieger 19:28:39 11/14/05 (0)
- Re: Well, y'all know - john curl 09:33:18 11/14/05 (44)
- Re: Well, y'all know - Steve Eddy 09:57:06 11/14/05 (43)
- LOL!... - mkuller 10:53:34 11/14/05 (42)
- Grab a clue. - Steve Eddy 15:09:01 11/14/05 (4)
- Re: Grab a clue. - john curl 20:53:37 11/14/05 (3)
- Re: Grab a clue. - Steve Eddy 21:48:41 11/14/05 (2)
- Re: Grab a clue. - john curl 15:29:14 11/16/05 (1)
- Re: Grab a clue. - Steve Eddy 16:48:11 11/16/05 (0)
- What sex act y'all on about? - Silver Eared John 11:41:47 11/14/05 (36)
- Re: What sex act y'all on about? - jneutron 12:16:07 11/14/05 (35)
- Afraid of? - mkuller 13:53:24 11/14/05 (34)
- Re: Afraid of? - Steve Eddy 19:06:59 11/14/05 (33)
- Rules? - mkuller 14:09:02 11/16/05 (32)
- Re: Rules? - Steve Eddy 18:57:12 11/16/05 (0)
- Hey, Steve - Silver Eared John 15:54:35 11/16/05 (30)
- Waaait a minute, here... - mkuller 14:39:16 11/17/05 (24)
- Ok, y'all know about digital recording and sampling, then? - Silver Eared John 19:23:29 11/17/05 (23)
- Ignorance..... - Todd Krieger 20:42:47 11/20/05 (0)
- Got any evidence for this? - mkuller 09:10:58 11/18/05 (16)
- Evasion noted. - Silver Eared John 14:09:07 11/18/05 (6)
- So you make up a lie... - mkuller 16:47:22 11/19/05 (5)
- Evasion again noted. - Silver Eared John 00:56:10 11/20/05 (4)
- Who are you talking about? - mkuller 11:31:40 11/20/05 (3)
- You - Silver Eared John 14:06:06 11/20/05 (2)
- Just crawl away... - mkuller 11:33:27 11/21/05 (1)
- Byeee. Keep crawling - Silver Eared John 13:37:31 11/21/05 (0)
- Well, I'm trying to find out - Silver Eared John 11:35:00 11/18/05 (8)
- So you admit... - mkuller 11:50:25 11/18/05 (7)
- Quoting you from above in this thread - Silver Eared John 14:13:01 11/18/05 (6)
- Re: Quoting you from above in this thread - john curl 17:34:38 11/18/05 (5)
- Y'all like to call names, don't y'all? - Silver Eared John 01:22:24 11/19/05 (4)
- Re: Y'all like to call names, don't y'all? - john curl 09:22:52 11/19/05 (3)
- Yep, y'all just like to call names. - Silver Eared John 10:43:21 11/19/05 (2)
- Hypocrite - look in the mirror... LOL!... - mkuller 13:42:12 11/20/05 (1)
- I can. Can y'all, or do you wince when you look? - Silver Eared John 18:12:54 11/22/05 (0)
- Re: Ok, y'all know about digital recording and sampling, then? - john curl 22:56:04 11/17/05 (4)
- Re: Ok, y'all know about digital recording and sampling, then? - Todd Krieger 21:29:24 11/20/05 (0)
- Y'all still confused, I see - Silver Eared John 11:33:46 11/18/05 (2)
- Re: Y'all still confused, I see - john curl 19:52:22 11/19/05 (1)
- Y'all didn't know him at all, I hear... - Silver Eared John 00:57:05 11/20/05 (0)
- Who's stalkin' who, slick?...(nt) - mkuller 12:10:55 11/17/05 (0)
- Re: Hey, Steve - Steve Eddy 19:11:33 11/16/05 (0)
- Re: Hey, Steve - john curl 18:19:32 11/16/05 (2)
- Hey, John... - mkuller 09:13:07 11/18/05 (1)
- Re: Hey, John... - john curl 11:56:23 11/18/05 (0)