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104.12.45.20
In Reply to: RE: I'm getting into portable music and IEM/earbuds, cheaper ones... posted by Bob_C on August 13, 2018 at 23:19:17
although the 'Rank the best IEMs you've heard' thread is also entertaining for me. Some of these IEMs, not even 'customs,' are fetching some big bucks--like $2,000-$4,000 a pair is no big deal.
Right now, I'm in that experimental <$25 range and have already received a KZ (Knowledge Zenith) ZST hybrid (DD+BA) and a Symphonized NRG 3.0 (DD) set, with MusicMaker and Geek Wold sets coming.
What is disturbing me the most about modern earphones, whether earbuds or IEMS, is that they're engineered to be 'colored' and EQed to the Nth degree.
The V-shaped frequency response is mind blowing to me, but it's sought after and that's contrary to what I believe HiFi should be. I realize that everything has a sonic signature and some people prefer X, Y or Z signatures, but to knowingly go out and engineer a 10dB peak at 500Hz and then a 7dB suck-out at 7kHz, is perplexing, but I guess that's what people want?
Anyhow, I think once these two arrive, I'll be done with earphones until I decide if I want to upgrade my 14+ year old iPod, lol.
Anyhow, the Chinese are making some pretty advanced stuff for not a lot of cash...much like modern flashlights.
Thanks.
Chris
Follow Ups:
Hi Chris,
I also prefer a more natural sound signature. Maybe it's an age thing! lol
It is pretty amazing how good some of the inexpensive stuff sounds.
Ones I have. The KZ ED16 have natural tuning. They are $18. The RevoNext RN-QT2 are $38 with the link are also nice. The TRN V20 is $19 and the V80s which I have not heard but reviewed well, are $28 with the link. If you are looking to spend more I would give a serious look at the Audeze iSines. IMO a full-size sound in an IEM format.
I've read the big KZ thread and I'm probably good with what I have, from them. I recently had a guy on the gun board telling me he wouldn't use my ZSTs if I bought them from him, but coming off of a Target special Skull Candy, they and the Symphonized jobbies sound good and are well broken in.
Some stuff that I have on my Ebay watch list:
iBasso IT 01 @ $110 shipped.
Final Audio Heaven II @ $90 shipped.
Kinera SEED @ $50 shipped.
Tin Audio T2 @ $52ish shipped.
There are so many to choose from in that under $50, $40, even $30 range, that trying a few isn't that much of a monetary hardship for me and I'm kind of poor, lol.
I'm content with AAC and my iPod and might just live with those. A member here, who I worked with over the past 5 months, got an LG V30 just for the MQA circuit and he's loving it.
He just got a pair of CampFire Audio Lyra IIs in and let me listen to an iBasso entry model while we worked, but it was just for a few seconds.
I'll wait for the two I have coming next week, from Penon Audio in Hong Kong and then I'll probably just cool off a bit...start looking for one of the better, but still cheap ( <$200) DAPs and see what I see.
I just thought it odd, that in a subset of the HiFi (Fidelity/Truth) hobby, that people are actually striving for a F.R. plot that looks as if somebody was undergoing electro-shock therapy, when they plotted it.
Chris
" I just thought it odd, that in a subset of the HiFi (Fidelity/Truth) hobby, that people are actually striving for a F.R. plot that looks as if somebody was undergoing electro-shock therapy, when they plotted it."
If what I am correct about what you are referring to this is the result of lots of research that has been going on for some years regarding the different transfer characteristics to the ear of sound from a distant loudspeaker compared to a headphone or IEM placed directly on the pinnae or in the ear canal. In brief a headphone frequency response that measures flat just sounds incorrect and not at all " flat" to the majority of people. So the ideal frequency response looks like a plan for a roller coaster. The research ( primarily by Harman) continues to refine the ideal curve as knowledge grows.
I've looked at some of the better IEMs, that musicians might buy and their F.R.s are a lot flatter and I've read various comments by people using these better IEMs: Empire Ears, CampFire Audio, Noble, 64 Audio, Jomo et. al and it really has nothing to do with how the sound is transferred through the ear canal.
Some people just like/want the V-shaped sound signature and some don't, so these IEMs/earbuds are all over the map. Why these IEM/earbud makers just don't make them flatter and let the listener use their DAP's EQ settings, is what I don't understand?
The V-shape sound seems to 'not be due' to a design obstacle, but a preferred EQ for bass heads and rockers, but not for people who are completely into the human voice.
I haven't read of too many people talking about using Patricia Barber, Adele, John Coltrane, or the London Symphony, to review their new $2000 CIEM, so perhaps it's merely 'genre driven?'
Since a lot of this stuff is coming from China/SE Asia, perhaps due to travel/work conditions, people need the bass/treble boost just to hear anything? I don't know, but some of the graphs I've seen are highly exaggerated and people still love/enjoy it, at least in moderation.
Music choices I think, also come into play and heavy bass oriented music seems to be very popular these days. Hence the bass, lack of mid-range freqs and slight treble boost before a steep roll off.
Chris
Yes, some people do prefer a V shaped response. I think that it is because " audio" lost the meaning of " high fidelity" years ago , at least as far as civilians are concerned.
Once records ceased to try to replicate the sound of live performers in a room then the concept of high fidelity lost its relevance. If the sound on the record is synthetic ( as it is in just about all pop music records which are what most people listen to) then it is impossible to judge through experience what is or isn't likely to be correct. Thereon personal taste rather than accuracy becomes the arbiter. I blame the Beatles :-)
"I just thought it odd, that in a subset of the HiFi (Fidelity/Truth) hobby, that people are actually striving for a F.R. plot that looks as if somebody was undergoing electro-shock therapy, when they plotted it."
That's very funny lol...
I have the T2s, they are nice also.
I am not a big headphone person so was not looking to spend big $$ on IEMs. Still, prefer speakers. But...
My headphones consist of some classic Stax, a Hi-Fi Man 400s, Fidelio X2s, iSineLX and iSines 20s.
I use an old modified Ipod 5.5 Rockboxed with an amp, an LG V20 I use as a DAP (excellent DAC/amp chip), a Rockboxed Sansa Fuze and a iPhone 6S+. I am currently enjoying the iSines allot, they are very nice but need EQ, hence the cipher cable with the iPhone or the parametric EQ with Rockbox, or USB Audio Player Pro on the V20.
Collecting the cheaper IEMs becomes a bit addictive. :)
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