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104.12.45.20
but this place seems more 'headphones' oriented...duh?
Anybody into inexpensive to moderately priced (~$100) IEMs, or earbuds?
For now, it's only a 4th Gen. iPod, so don't blow out any O-rings pondering things.
I'm on Head-Fi, so maybe that's the best place?
Chris
Follow Ups:
I have several IEMs but I want a bluetooth set small enough to wear for daily walks. I have a pr of Beats solo on-ear headphones I got for free with an Apple bonus give-away that came with the iMac I bought my wife last year. They are surprisingly pretty good, and comfortable for the limited time I've used them, but not IEMs. I want the bt IEMs for some music, but probably mostly either streaming or news stations, so sound quality isn't critical. If it was, I wouldn't be shopping bluetooth. I have other headphones for that.
Anyhow.... Beats also makes an IEM 'BeatsX' which got pretty good reviews @ $149, but can be had now for $89 in some places. Apple still has them at $149, of course. I was about to pull the trigger at Costco yesterday, on sale for $99, till I noticed several places selling them at $89, incl Best Buy. I like the idea of the lightweight connector and the magnet clips to keep them together, vs Apple ear pods or whatever, which I'd probably just lose. Unless someone has a better idea.....
I ordered these from Amazon, great battery life, GREAT sound, light, good fit, fast charge.
$29
SENSO Bluetooth Headphones, Best Wireless Sports Earphones w/Mic IPX7 Waterproof HD Stereo Sweatproof Earbuds for Gym Running Workout 8 Hour Battery Noise Cancelling Headsets
Compared to Klipsch AS-5i In-Ear Headphones for about $40 the Senso is better...although the Klipsch is not bluetooth.
Compared to Beyerdynamic T50p for about $200 the Senso is almost as good, a little duller on the highs but a little fuller on the mids. However the Bey's have a very poor cable...lasted about 6mo before wire broke internally.
Dynobots Audio - Music is the Bridge Between Heaven and Earth
I just bought a Shanling M0 DAP which is about the size of a square wrist watch and it feels ridiculous to walk about wearing a full size set of Fostex phones with it.
The choice of cheap(ish) IEMs is truly bewildering.
The Geek Wold (new one) and the MusicMaker ToneKing TS1 IEMs.
Both are dynamic drivers (as opposed to balanced armatures/BAs, or DD+BA) with the GW having three DDs and both were $40 shipped from Hong Kong. Got them off of Ebay from the same seller and I'm running them in now.
All four of mine (KZ ZST/Symphonized & NGR 3.0) are V-Sound, so there are peaks and valleys.
Anyhow, I think I'll sit tight with these four and just listen for a while.
The next step would be some of the $50 ones, of which there are plenty.
Spending $300-$500 would probably be stupid without upgrading from my iPod Gen. 4, so I have that hurdle as well.
There's a thread on Head-Fi for <$100 Chinese IEMs/earbuds, so read there.
Chris
The T2s will be $30 in a few days, as per the mentioned thread.The KZ ED16 really have a balanced sound and IMO a gem in the KZ line.
Edits: 08/22/18
I think that they're flatter than the KZ ZST, but they do have a V-shaped sound. Involving and fun, which is why most people love the V-shape signature.
Still, it goes against Hi-Fidelity, where +/- 3dB has been 'the standard' for home HiFi gear.
I'm going to try a $50-$100 set soon, so I'll report back.
Chris
Although I have already forgotten the model and within 4 hours a new one was announced on massdrop, just matching a new Shanling player...
I don't like to stick anything into my ears. I value my hearing and sticking foreign objects into my ears seems like a bad idea to me.With proper maintenance I am certain users could argue that it is safe but I am talking about that one exception. The thing we don't plan on.
It seems like inviting problems to stick those things in my ear canal. I will go as far as the ear buds that sit outside the ear canal but I won't stick anything in it.
Its just not worth it to me.
Just one man's opinion,
Ed
We don't shush around here!
Life is analog...digital is just samples thereof
Edits: 08/15/18
my dad's a doc and always dissuaded us from using Q-Tips in the ear, for cleaning purposes, so I understand taking precautions.
The problem with IEMs, is that they work best when sealed in the ear canal proper. What happens is that people play music loudly and this creates a pressure wave, which has no where to go, or vent, so the pressure wave impinges on and bombards the ear drum. To compensate, the ear muscles tighten around the drum, causing a perceived loss of sound/volume, which then results in the listener bumping up the volume, which then causes more permanent damage.
I forget the company's name, but they created a 'device' that actually acts as a second 'ear drum' and protects the biologic drum from being injured.
Anyhow...I've got 20 guns here, 30# of smokeless powder and 23,000 primers, so I live with a little bit of risk, but I do take precautions.
Chris
Good sound on a budget. There are also budget IEM threads on Head-Fi.
although the 'Rank the best IEMs you've heard' thread is also entertaining for me. Some of these IEMs, not even 'customs,' are fetching some big bucks--like $2,000-$4,000 a pair is no big deal.
Right now, I'm in that experimental <$25 range and have already received a KZ (Knowledge Zenith) ZST hybrid (DD+BA) and a Symphonized NRG 3.0 (DD) set, with MusicMaker and Geek Wold sets coming.
What is disturbing me the most about modern earphones, whether earbuds or IEMS, is that they're engineered to be 'colored' and EQed to the Nth degree.
The V-shaped frequency response is mind blowing to me, but it's sought after and that's contrary to what I believe HiFi should be. I realize that everything has a sonic signature and some people prefer X, Y or Z signatures, but to knowingly go out and engineer a 10dB peak at 500Hz and then a 7dB suck-out at 7kHz, is perplexing, but I guess that's what people want?
Anyhow, I think once these two arrive, I'll be done with earphones until I decide if I want to upgrade my 14+ year old iPod, lol.
Anyhow, the Chinese are making some pretty advanced stuff for not a lot of cash...much like modern flashlights.
Thanks.
Chris
Hi Chris,
I also prefer a more natural sound signature. Maybe it's an age thing! lol
It is pretty amazing how good some of the inexpensive stuff sounds.
Ones I have. The KZ ED16 have natural tuning. They are $18. The RevoNext RN-QT2 are $38 with the link are also nice. The TRN V20 is $19 and the V80s which I have not heard but reviewed well, are $28 with the link. If you are looking to spend more I would give a serious look at the Audeze iSines. IMO a full-size sound in an IEM format.
I've read the big KZ thread and I'm probably good with what I have, from them. I recently had a guy on the gun board telling me he wouldn't use my ZSTs if I bought them from him, but coming off of a Target special Skull Candy, they and the Symphonized jobbies sound good and are well broken in.
Some stuff that I have on my Ebay watch list:
iBasso IT 01 @ $110 shipped.
Final Audio Heaven II @ $90 shipped.
Kinera SEED @ $50 shipped.
Tin Audio T2 @ $52ish shipped.
There are so many to choose from in that under $50, $40, even $30 range, that trying a few isn't that much of a monetary hardship for me and I'm kind of poor, lol.
I'm content with AAC and my iPod and might just live with those. A member here, who I worked with over the past 5 months, got an LG V30 just for the MQA circuit and he's loving it.
He just got a pair of CampFire Audio Lyra IIs in and let me listen to an iBasso entry model while we worked, but it was just for a few seconds.
I'll wait for the two I have coming next week, from Penon Audio in Hong Kong and then I'll probably just cool off a bit...start looking for one of the better, but still cheap ( <$200) DAPs and see what I see.
I just thought it odd, that in a subset of the HiFi (Fidelity/Truth) hobby, that people are actually striving for a F.R. plot that looks as if somebody was undergoing electro-shock therapy, when they plotted it.
Chris
" I just thought it odd, that in a subset of the HiFi (Fidelity/Truth) hobby, that people are actually striving for a F.R. plot that looks as if somebody was undergoing electro-shock therapy, when they plotted it."
If what I am correct about what you are referring to this is the result of lots of research that has been going on for some years regarding the different transfer characteristics to the ear of sound from a distant loudspeaker compared to a headphone or IEM placed directly on the pinnae or in the ear canal. In brief a headphone frequency response that measures flat just sounds incorrect and not at all " flat" to the majority of people. So the ideal frequency response looks like a plan for a roller coaster. The research ( primarily by Harman) continues to refine the ideal curve as knowledge grows.
I've looked at some of the better IEMs, that musicians might buy and their F.R.s are a lot flatter and I've read various comments by people using these better IEMs: Empire Ears, CampFire Audio, Noble, 64 Audio, Jomo et. al and it really has nothing to do with how the sound is transferred through the ear canal.
Some people just like/want the V-shaped sound signature and some don't, so these IEMs/earbuds are all over the map. Why these IEM/earbud makers just don't make them flatter and let the listener use their DAP's EQ settings, is what I don't understand?
The V-shape sound seems to 'not be due' to a design obstacle, but a preferred EQ for bass heads and rockers, but not for people who are completely into the human voice.
I haven't read of too many people talking about using Patricia Barber, Adele, John Coltrane, or the London Symphony, to review their new $2000 CIEM, so perhaps it's merely 'genre driven?'
Since a lot of this stuff is coming from China/SE Asia, perhaps due to travel/work conditions, people need the bass/treble boost just to hear anything? I don't know, but some of the graphs I've seen are highly exaggerated and people still love/enjoy it, at least in moderation.
Music choices I think, also come into play and heavy bass oriented music seems to be very popular these days. Hence the bass, lack of mid-range freqs and slight treble boost before a steep roll off.
Chris
Yes, some people do prefer a V shaped response. I think that it is because " audio" lost the meaning of " high fidelity" years ago , at least as far as civilians are concerned.
Once records ceased to try to replicate the sound of live performers in a room then the concept of high fidelity lost its relevance. If the sound on the record is synthetic ( as it is in just about all pop music records which are what most people listen to) then it is impossible to judge through experience what is or isn't likely to be correct. Thereon personal taste rather than accuracy becomes the arbiter. I blame the Beatles :-)
"I just thought it odd, that in a subset of the HiFi (Fidelity/Truth) hobby, that people are actually striving for a F.R. plot that looks as if somebody was undergoing electro-shock therapy, when they plotted it."
That's very funny lol...
I have the T2s, they are nice also.
I am not a big headphone person so was not looking to spend big $$ on IEMs. Still, prefer speakers. But...
My headphones consist of some classic Stax, a Hi-Fi Man 400s, Fidelio X2s, iSineLX and iSines 20s.
I use an old modified Ipod 5.5 Rockboxed with an amp, an LG V20 I use as a DAP (excellent DAC/amp chip), a Rockboxed Sansa Fuze and a iPhone 6S+. I am currently enjoying the iSines allot, they are very nice but need EQ, hence the cipher cable with the iPhone or the parametric EQ with Rockbox, or USB Audio Player Pro on the V20.
Collecting the cheaper IEMs becomes a bit addictive. :)
I have Hifiman songbirds. They are about $100. They sound great and are well built. I had Shure IEM before at about the same price point. Also nice. I heard Periodic brand at CAF. They also had a nice $100 set.I drive them and my Sennheiser Over the Ear Momentums from my IPhone and a Dragonfly Red . The Dragonfly made a bid difference in SQ.
Gsquared
Edits: 08/13/18
I have some Etymotic HF-5s that I bought years ago when travelling. Full price now seems to be $99. Good points are that they are tiny and they come with a little purse to hold then so they can live in my jacket pocket for use with my Samsung phone if I find myself waiting for half an hour for a bus or have a similar need to while away some time. I use them with Comply foam tips which I much prefer to those supplied.
Sound quality is OK but I wouldn't place it much higher, at least for listening to, say, orchestral music. The phone will just about drive them directly but far more pleasurable results come from inserting an Audioquest Dragonly Red into the mix .
The attenuation of external sound is excellent, so another good point there.
IEMs are very difficult things to buy as hygiene precludes pre-purchase auditions. Whatever you choose you pay the man and take a chance that you will like the result. I have no idea how folk bring themselves to buy those IEMs costing $1K+ given this.
yes, they are good sounding and isolate very well but are delicate. damage a wire on it and all you have is a small discount on new ones. and the wire is so thin that it's nigh impossible to splice.
you would think that they would have some kind of plug-in wires but no dice.
...regards...tr
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