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Tubes Asylum Questions about tubes and gear that glows. FAQ |
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Tubes Asylum Questions about tubes and gear that glows. FAQ |
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In Reply to: recommend a 5751 posted by enginesix on September 27, 2006 at 14:23:16:
You're re/tubing the four tubes in your PV-12's phonostage? The phonostage of my PV-12A sadly sits tubeless and idle. I've not ever listened to the phonostage of my PV-12A, but I'm happy to dispense some words about 5751s ;)Here're some first words - give it a listen. Someone's suggestions may result in sonics that seem to be as described, but I suggest that your results will likely vary. Ultimately, you'll just have to give a listen yourself. The point kukakunga makes is, in my experience, right on. It's most often the entire tube complement that needs to be considered (as well as how all the other parts of the system work together for your ears in your room). I've had the experience kukakunga relays. A tube sounds awful when used together with certain tubes, and just great when used with other tubes. You've got to find that complementary complement.
Perhaps fortunate, the world of 5751s is rather small, at least compared with the number of 12AU7, 12AX7, 6SN7, etc., variants. The number of 5751 curiosities is manageable. As with the very large tube families, they barely allow even contemplating sampling the entirety of such impracticably large universes of variation, where the 5751 universe is small enough that you can wrap yourself around the thought that you can actually sample every different 5751 type.
In my experience with CJ stuff, I do think the GE 3-mica black-plate tubes are perhaps the best 5751 value today. There're four variants here, so bewary of what you buy. Fortunately, they all sound very similar. The earliest ones have "clips" securing the innerds assemblies and a rectangular getter. The last of them have D-getters and support rods. The earlier GE 3-mica gray plate, the one with the D-getter and no support rods, I've recently rolled and really liked. While they can be nice-enough sounding, the 2-mica GEs haven't been my favorite, at least to my ears in my gear. CJ used the late-production GE, usually the military green-print JAN tube, forever as their OE 5751.
For RCAs, I like the early 3-mica tube. The one with the serrated-edge top mica. The JRC/Command-style 2-mica black plate tube is consistently very good sounding, I think. I suggest not bothering with the fancy JRC or Command labeled instances of this tube. Plain old RCA and OE branded tubes are typically much less pricey and are the same tube.
I believe that Siemens did make a 5751. At least I've got 3-mica gray plate tubes bearing Munich manufacturing origin codes and silkscreened as 5751s. Maybe they're really all Siemens/Philips E83CCs labeled as 5751s? Whatever is the case, clarity, leaning towards leaness, and speed characterize this tube for me.
As kukakunga mentions, I've also had the vaunted Sylvania 3-mica tubes sound "flabby." Change some tubes around them, and, wow, greatness. There are a couple of subvariants of both the black plate and gray plate tubes. All of them are bringing the biggest dollars of any 5751. While these Sylvanias are often my favorite 5751, I don't believe they're worth the premium over of the some of the other 5751s. It's been a while since I last listened to a the later 2-mica tube, so I'll refrain from commment - for now ;)
Raytheons? Well, there're the windmill getter types and some more conventional looking 3-mica black-plate types. I have had the windmill getter types to be on the bright side, but I have had them sound great when put together with some tube complements.
Tung Sols. There're at least three types. The earliest with an angled rectangular getter with two plate crimps per triode side, the ones with a D-getter also with two plate crimps per triode side, and the last production with an O-getter that has four plate crimps per triode side. There are some interstitial mixed contstruction variants, too. I have recently rolled these three main types through my CJ Prem 12s. I was disappointed with the rectangular getter tubes, but I really liked the D-getter and especially the O-getter types.
What's left? How about Sovteks/EHs? Don't know what to say about these at the moment. Are they real 5751s or are they really 12AX7s? I've seen some debate on this. Give'em a try and report back to us. Oh, I've got some BEL/Philips 5751s made in India which I haven't listened to yet. I know a few folks who really like this tube. I'm curious as to whether this tube is a real 5751, also. This tube's construction looks just like the last-production Philips 12AU7s (Gf9 type) and 12AX7s. I also have some CBS tubes that look very much like 3-mica gray plate GEs, but are just a hair different to make me think they aren't GEs. For example, they aren't etched with a GE dot pattern.
I don't know what the PV-12 phonostage sounds like, unfortunately. I've had many folks tell me it's very nice-sounding. Especially with the OE RFT 12AU7s, I don't find the linestage of this preamp is particularly soft or euphonic. The RFT is the OE 12AU7 used in the phonostage, too. I like this tube a lot and I could imagine it doing a good job in the phonostage - but I'm only imagining.
I think that's it for now...
Try some tubes and let us know what you find.
- SJ
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Follow Ups
- Re: recommend a 5751 - tvr2500m 20:31:38 09/28/06 (0)
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