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I have a tube amp that uses the GZ34 type. I get mixed information of the warm up time on the 5R4 types. The GZ34 is slower, allowing the tubes downstream to get the plate ready for the voltage/current. The voltage drop on the GZ34 is also much less than the 5R4 GY. I have read that the 5R4 type are much faster at delivering the voltage and current which isn't always best for tubes that will be receiving this.
Any thought on this is appreciated.
iBasso DX300MAX Ti. Focal Utopia and Stellia. iBasso SR2. Mr. Speakers, Ether II, Voce stats. Manley, Absolute headphone amp. LTA MZ3, Z10e electrostatic amp. Many other headphones, amps, cables etc.
Follow Ups:
Ripping the electrons off the cathode of a cold tube is a very high voltage problem. Relax. Audio tubes at 500v are not hurt this way. It was a marketing thing to extract maximum $$$ from someone hawking superraremetal5A44forevertubes.
however, don't leave tube heater on with no B+ for hours on end which can cause cathode poisoning, but that is the opposite problem.
so they were ready to go once the dime was put in?
iBasso DX300MAX Ti. Focal Utopia and Stellia. iBasso SR2. Mr. Speakers, Ether II, Voce stats. Manley, Absolute headphone amp. LTA MZ3, Z10e electrostatic amp. Many other headphones, amps, cables etc.
.
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
I worked on a couple of jukebox amps of the 78 and 45 era. Both amps powered down after play was complete. The 78 amp used 100% directly heated tubes and was ready to go from a cold start in a few seconds. The later amp used a directly heated rectifier with indirect 6.3V tubes everywhere else. The heater circuit was dual voltage ~ 10V at cold start which slammed everything up to temp in a few seconds. When the finals (PP 6L6G) began to conduct, a DC relay in the cathode circuit would energize and tap down to 6.3V. Kinda brute force but effective. Tubes were more expendable then.
nada aqui
The GZ34/5ar4 is indirectly heated. The 5r4 is directly heated.
Directly heated tubes are ready to conduct almost immediately once you throw the switch.
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
what I want to hear! lol :^(. Yes, directly heated vs indirect. I have some really nice 5R4GY 1945 rectifiers but it doesn't look I will get to use them in my gear. I have some nice metal base GZ34s but the GY are such nice tall coke bottle tubes. . . .
Thank you.
iBasso DX300MAX Ti. Focal Utopia and Stellia. iBasso SR2. Mr. Speakers, Ether II, Voce stats. Manley, Absolute headphone amp. LTA MZ3, Z10e electrostatic amp. Many other headphones, amps, cables etc.
You could use a delay relay and solve the problem of the B+ hitting the tubes before they are ready. There are different ways of doing that.
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
amp. I wonder if a CL90 would work.
iBasso DX300MAX Ti. Focal Utopia and Stellia. iBasso SR2. Mr. Speakers, Ether II, Voce stats. Manley, Absolute headphone amp. LTA MZ3, Z10e electrostatic amp. Many other headphones, amps, cables etc.
Is there a way to apply to only the B+?
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
I would have to open the unit to see where everything is going. But I think as a new unit, I won't do that and just use some nice metal base GZ34s. :^)
BTW, the company said that using the 5R4 GY was ok so maybe the voltage doesn't hit all at once. I heard from them yesterday. I think they may have the delay built in so I guess I may have made much to do about nothing.
Thank you for your input.
iBasso DX300MAX Ti. Focal Utopia and Stellia. iBasso SR2. Mr. Speakers, Ether II, Voce stats. Manley, Absolute headphone amp. LTA MZ3, Z10e electrostatic amp. Many other headphones, amps, cables etc.
How much voltage are you talking about? Most tubes in the 6L6/EL34 category don't need a B+ delay. Amps that need it generally rely on the delay to heat the driver and pre tubes so downstream caps don't go over-voltage. I use the 5R4GYB for its delay even in my 211 monos. At 1,050 VDC, the 211 does care, but it conducts before the 5R4GB applies voltage.
I haven't measured the actual voltage to the tube and 6SN7s on the front.
The rectifier 5R4gy doesn't have delay though, is that correct?
iBasso DX300MAX Ti. Focal Utopia and Stellia. iBasso SR2. Mr. Speakers, Ether II, Voce stats. Manley, Absolute headphone amp. LTA MZ3, Z10e electrostatic amp. Many other headphones, amps, cables etc.
I haven't actually timed it, but the 5R4GYB exhibits a delay of several seconds. It's not as long a delay as the 5AR4, and it might not be sufficient to protect downstream capacitors. Indirectly-heated small signal tubes can require an appreciable amount of time to conduct. If B+ comes up before they conduct, all the downstream RC decoupling networks will be operating at main B+ voltage. One solution to this (other than a long delay) is to be sure the voltage rating of all the downstream capacitors is up to the task.
for the 5R4GY and they said it is fine. So I assume, with their years of experience it hopefully is. I know they are fairly conservative, as a manufacturer should be.
I was watching the heaters on the GY come on and they were slower than the rest of the tubes, KT170 and 6SN7 types. I could put in my test sockets and measure but just don't feel like it at this time.
I do enjoy tubes. Used them as a radioman in the military and building my first tube receiver in high school in the latter 1960. Thank god my hearing is still really good so I can enjoy music etc. :^)
iBasso DX300MAX Ti. Focal Utopia and Stellia. iBasso SR2. Mr. Speakers, Ether II, Voce stats. Manley, Absolute headphone amp. LTA MZ3, Z10e electrostatic amp. Many other headphones, amps, cables etc.
When were you a radioman? I got my first ham license when I was 14. By the time I was 16, I was copying Morse by ear at 60 WPM (much faster than I could write it down). All irrelevant now, of course.
much slower than that. Spin, who had been a radioman for years, used a bug and could send and receive like talking, even look around. We used a typewriter of course but he was the fastest and cleanest I had ever seen.
1968 to 72. Vietnam, sadly, a horrible war. Twice there. 69 and 71.
iBasso DX300MAX Ti. Focal Utopia and Stellia. iBasso SR2. Mr. Speakers, Ether II, Voce stats. Manley, Absolute headphone amp. LTA MZ3, Z10e electrostatic amp. Many other headphones, amps, cables etc.
When you say you used a typewriter, I assume you mean radioteletype (RTTY). Yes, it was a terrible war, and I was lucky not to have to go (almost - I turned 18 in 1970). I strongly disagreed with our involvement, but I also greatly resented how returning vets were sometimes treated. So much was wrong in so many directions back then. Anyway, good luck with your amp. Sounds like you have it under control now. :)
I typed as I got messages, didn't write down by hand what I was receiving.Sometimes we couldn't get out by teletype and everything was encoded and I would be called upon to send out the messages. The other guys did about 6 words a minute. lol
I sometimes got great skips of 1000s of miles. Once getting clear back to Long Beach, Calif. We once were caught in a huge storm and nothing could get out and I had to send out flash messages by code
My brother who was 10 years older than me by coincidence was also a radioman in the Marines and knew code.
iBasso DX300MAX Ti. Focal Utopia and Stellia. iBasso SR2. Mr. Speakers, Ether II, Voce stats. Manley, Absolute headphone amp. LTA MZ3, Z10e electrostatic amp. Many other headphones, amps, cables etc.
Edits: 11/30/24
Got it - a typewriter! Man, I used to wish I could type! That was a real problem for me sometimes, but luckily most contacts on the air involve common words that are repeated from one conversation to the next. In fact, once speeds exceed 20 WPM or so, you switch from listening to the sound of individual characters to the sound of complete words or abbreviations. That really speeds things up.
I was a ham for more than 50 years, with Morse and DIY being the main interest. I eventually abandoned it when I came back after a 10 year absence and discovered very few CW ops could keep up with me. I had put together a full break-in CW system running a kilowatt, so it was very disappointing. Then I found that the 80M novice band where I had cut my teeth decades earlier had been moved to make way for more phone privileges, and that the bands were full of no-code licensees. That was the last straw. :)
I've been involved in audio since the early '70s, and leaving ham radio coincided with revisiting tubes. My first transmitter was a DIY job using a 1625, so it was a natural transition to the hobby here.
It's interesting that you and your brother were both code guys. I joined the MARS program at one time, but it was cut short when I started college. I still remember listening to some of the messages from Vietnam.
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