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In Reply to: RE: Discussion summary posted by tomservo on November 08, 2022 at 06:12:34
The only constraints are the ones we bring with us. - Computer Sciences Corporation slogan
I'm not trying to set the world on fire, only start a flame in a few hearts. - Ed "Kookie" Burns
People would be much better off if they believed in too much rather than too little. - PT Barnum
Follow Ups:
The problem is, one can speculate all they want, imagine what they want and believe what you want about how things work, but if your job is designing things which depend the engineering properties which are not at all subjective judgements, one is limited to things which happen in that engineering domain.
IE, knowing your guitar as played by X musician, doesn't actually make it sound better other than the degree that knowledge changes the impression in your head.
In that world, a speaker cable cannot change what a speaker actually does unless it changes the signal arriving at the terminals.
But in reality, perhaps not your reality, cables DO change the signal arriving at the terminals. They change the signal in either direction no matter which way they're inserted into the system but they change it even more when they're inserted in the wrong direction.Advanced Audiophiles have learned a lot about cables since the early days. Directionality is not some new concept, audiophiles have known about it more 25 years. We have seen higher purity copper and silver conductors for about the same period, and air dielectrics and silver connectors, and cryogenics. Eliminating static electric charge, magnetic fields and vibration from cables. You'd have to be living in a cave these days not to be somewhat cognizant of these advancements. Highly polished conductor surfaces, directional power cords, directional fuses, directional HDMI cables. Oh, my! Try to break free from your reality tunnel.
Edits: 11/09/22
It just seems odd that the only audio companies that seem to tout the directionality of the wire they use are cable companies.
I've never seen a transformer company that advertises that the wire in their transformers has been wound with wire that has been oriented "correctly".
Same for companies selling amps and other gear, even exclusive high dollar "audiophile" brands. Since their customers are presumably "Advanced Audiophiles" you would think they would want to reassure them that the wire in their gear is oriented correctly, especially if this might give them a competitive edge.
Speakers? Never seen it mentioned, either. And on and on.
Only audio cable manufacturers.
Not that I'm particularly familiar with such advertising. Perhaps I'm wrong and, if so, maybe you could give some examples of non-cable audio companies that do mention this issue.
What about cable companies that are not primarily audio oriented? Belden is one of, if not the, largest cable manufacturers in the world. Perhaps a few of their products are used in applications where it matters and labelled as such. But I don't recall seeing any of their products labelled for directionality.
Do the engineers at Belden need to "break free of their reality tunnels" too?
But all the potential customers might think they were weird if they advertised it. It's like cryogenics, a lot of "audio enthusiasts" like yourself probably think it's weird, right?Audiophile fuse companies tell customers they should try the fuse both ways. Since, you know, all wire is directional, even silly little fuses. The fact some big commercial companies never heard of directionality doesn't surprise me, in fact that's what I would expect. I have to admit it warms my heart to think I know more about their product than they do.
An ordinary man has no means of deliverance.
Edits: 11/10/22 11/10/22 11/10/22
--> "But all the potential customers might think they were weird if they advertised it." <--
We're talking about the same customers who the cable companies are marketing their wares to, "Advanced Audiophiles", not someone who's buying a home theater setup at Best Buy or Walmart.
--> "The fact some big commercial companies never heard of directionality doesn't surprise me, in fact that's what I would expect. I have to admit it warms my heart to think I know more about their product than they do." <--
So you claim to know more about wire than the engineers at Belden? Hilarious.
I know about wire directionality. They don't. If they did they'd put arrows on their cables. You figure it out.
"but like" is a deflection from the very specific issue of directional wire isn't it?
What question do you have I haven't already answered? When people start picking at my words it looks like the discussion is ended.
"You'd have to be living in a cave these days not to be somewhat cognizant of these advancements. Highly polished conductor surfaces, directional power cords, directional fuses, directional HDMI cables. Oh, my! Try to break free from your reality tunnel. "
We we each have job's to do in audio, it would seem our tools and concepts behind what we design are very different.
It's a little like using cryogenics for cables, first everyone poo-pooed the whole idea 25 years ago, then before you know it, a great many high end cable companies were using cryogenics. You can't compete in the high end unless you are able to keep up with technology. Think of Directionality as a new "technology" - another tool in one's toolbox. It's all about competition. Good luck in your endeavors.The law of maximization: No matter how much you have in the end you would have had even more if you had started out with more.
Edits: 11/10/22
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