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136.33.194.11
Hi folks. Gotta question and hoping to get some guidance. I just "retired" a mid-2012 MacBook Pro that sounded great USB-out AQ jitterbugged to a DAC . . . in favor of a late 2023 Mac Mini M2 in which the same configuration sounds like stone doo-doo. Hard upper mids, harsh treble, blah, blah. Anyone have the same or similar experience? I've tried everything, but the sonic signature remains the same. Thoughts, advice? My sources are Apple Music and Qobuz. (My largish outboard NAS storage threatened to overwhelm the MacBook Pro OS.)
Follow Ups:
I have an M1 Mac mini. I prefer my linux music server. I just updated to MacOS 15.1 because of the Apple Intelligence AI feature and plugged it into my DAC for fun. Of note I can get to 32bit 768khz with the USB Audio now and I don't know how to explain it, but it sounds different than Windows and Linux.
If you prefer intel based sound moving forward I don't think MacOS will be supported for long on it, in favor of their own M series processors. I can tell you Windows 11 sounds great compared to Linux and Apple. I keep my linux server because I upscale to DSD.
Maybe you can try to upgrade to version 15.1 of MacOS because I noticed USB Audio seems improved. At least that's what I see.
If that didn't change the sound, then try connecting the sound with a 3.5mm cable to 2 RCAs. If that works, at least your NAS is working fine.
One other thing that might be an issue. If you're using a USB hub and have several connections on it, it may not have enough power. The AQ jitterbug might need more power than sharing a hub on it.
Good luck.
-Rod
Thanks for the response. Much appreciated. I've tried just about everything the others suggested, including pulling out the AQ Jitterbug. Unfortunately the "sound signature" remains the same, while all other parameters appear normal. I have a revealing Lowther-based system, and it might just be a system mismatch that the MBP doesn''t produce, and accordingly, I've restored it to service.
I avoid heavily RFI prone general purpose computers for serious playback.
My MacMini works fine for the office/around house system but prefer using music playback specific endpoints using small footprint Linux based operating systems in primary systems. Don't need hundreds of concurrent processes just to play music. :)
With today's geopolitics effecting economies and consumer products its entirely possible that some or many of the internal parts of the MM have been sourced from other companies and/or the specs of those parts have changed to some degree.
My reasoning is, we've all noticed Shrinkflation; a form of inflation, most common in food and beverage, that consists of reducing a product's size while maintaining its retail price. I've also noticed this in other products, everything is thinner, cheaper, weaker...than before.
J.
"My reasoning is, we've all noticed Shrinkflation; a form of inflation, most common in food and beverage, that consists of reducing a product's size while maintaining its retail price. I've also noticed this in other products, everything is thinner, cheaper, weaker...than before."The size of the Mac Mini hasn't changed in 15 years so I doubt there's any shrinkflation going on here. On the other hand, the performance has increased substantially and prices have actually gone down.
Not that any of that has much of an impact on sound. The DAC is where the rubber meets the road in terms of sound quality. The computer, not so much.... assuming the system is properly setup.
Edits: 10/27/24 10/27/24
Shrinkflation in action after all. Overall volume (HxWxD) down by 40%. I feel jipped ;-) Priced the same but better performance. It's nice that they brought at least a couple jacks up front. This Mini caught me off guard. I didn't see it coming. Thanks.5"x5"x2" $599 MSRP
Edits: 10/30/24 10/30/24 10/30/24 10/30/24
Hmmmmmmmm.
Your comments, not mine:
10/28/24
"The size of the Mac Mini hasn't changed in 15 years so I doubt there's any shrinkflation going on here."
"...which I thought was crazy train bizarre in the context of this thread!"
10/30/24
"Shrinkflation in action after all. Overall volume (HxWxD) down by 40%."
I guess the crazy train came to town after all.... 'All Aboard!'
J.
After nearly 15 years the crazy train has arrived !
I didn't think I was insinuating that the MM has gotten smaller and somehow this was the reason it might sound different.
That's an interesting twist.
J.
Your comments, not mine:
"With today's geopolitics......"
"My reasoning is, we've all noticed Shrinkflation....."
which I thought was crazy train bizarre in the context of this thread!
;-)
.
My previous Mac Mini music server was the 2012 Intel i7 quad core. I ran it on its stock internal power supply and an external 12v linear power supply. Not much difference in sound quality.Today I'm running a stock Mac Mini M1 which sounds the same.
One thing to consider is to ensure that the USB DAC is on a dedicated Mac USB bus / controller. You can see the USB tree in System Information -> USB. And of course make sure your software is setup properly. If you can't find the System Information icon just do a spotlight search (the magnifying glass) and input "System Information" [Enter] which will launch it.
P.S. What does this mean? It makes no sense to me: " My largish outboard NAS storage threatened to overwhelm the MacBook Pro OS. ". If I'm not running my Mac Mini as the music server (for Roon), I'm running Roon on the Synology NAS.
Edits: 10/26/24 10/26/24
Thank you! Very much appreciate the advice. The reference to NAS is a misnomer of sorts. I had "retired" the 2012 MacBook Pro because I didn't trust that the long-unsupported OS was sufficiently stable to support the TB or so of music files on my outboard SSD storage. I've been satisfied with Apple Music as a primary source, although occasionally I'll open Audirvana for a little variety. Audirvana's GUI isn't a dream, as you likely know, but admittedly it operates pretty flawlessly on the newish Mac mini. (Output from Audirvana was different of course, but similarly flawed via the Mac mini.) Thanks again.
Audirvana was my favorite for a long time and I'm sure its even better today. I just happened to switch to Roon a few years back. Othewise I'd probably still be running Audirvana.
I'm not sure how the Apple Music and Qobuz Apps handle sample-rate switching on the Mac. I assume it's automatic (like Audirvana) but I'm not certain.
Some half random thoughts on this topic.
1. Can't be the same configuration. The MacBook Pro is running a different version of MacOS than the Mini and uses a power brick/battery whereas the Mini is using an internal power supply, no battery.
2. You have tried both USB A ports on the Mini and they both sound like stone doo-doo?
3. You have confirmed that the DAC is seeing the same sample frequency as before?
4. You have removed the Jitterbug from the chain and it still sounds like stone doo-doo on both USB A ports?
5. You have the tried the rotate the AC plug in the outlet trick with no sonic improvement?
6. You do or do not have the Mini plugged into a surge protector?
7. You have written to Craig Federighi and told him he f'ed up the audio handling between the OS on your MacBook Pro and the latest OS and he replied, bits is bits?
No golden ears necessary to hear that these bits ain't the same bits as before. Not even close. Nothing "wrong," per se, just comparatively horrible sound. I'm going to try some of your suggestions--thank you by the way, much appreciated--and see what. if anything works.
I have that basic setup and don't hear anything like you describe.
But lately I have been using a Matrix X DDC with i2S out into my DAC.
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