 
|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
|
|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
96.8.132.210
In Reply to: RE: What improvement can be expected with NOS DAC upgrades? posted by chuck55 on November 15, 2023 at 19:45:18
Current DACs offering NOS mode are generally R2R or Multi-Bit DACs. The stated goal of these designs is a more analog or smoother sound.I believe all Delta Sigma based DACs apply over sampling to all incoming signals.
R2R/Multi-bit DACs don't try to become "more Delta Sigma" their entire approach is to sound LESS Delta Sigma-like. Not as harsh, bright fatiguing.
The truth is, the bad rap about harshness with Delta Sigma designs probably lays more with a designer's poor implementation of the input and analog output stages of the DAC and less about the kind of chip used for the digital to audio conversion.
Edits: 11/16/23Follow Ups:
"ALL DACs including NOS DACs digitally oversample - the term NOS for a DAC is a non sequitur or a delusion. In the case of NOS it is technically a first order hold oversampling filter. And this digital filter is the worst possible digital interpolation filter to use; it's got horrendous measured and transient timing recovery performance."
Quote from Rob Watts, digital guru behind Chord Electronics:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/chord-electronics-dave.766517/page-1660
.
Edits: 11/16/23 11/18/23
The article you linked to is nearly 20 years old. Lots have improved since then. Is AudioZone the DAC maker still in business?"By removing the digital filter altogether; the impulse response is essentially perfect, without pre or post ringing."
Solving one problem perfectly and not addressing the many others is the easy way out and not a TOTAL solution.
"But from what I have read, NOS DAC's are supposed to time better."
Again, only one parameter is addressed.
From the ~20 year old article you linked to:
"Perhaps these unsuppressed images [in filter-less DACs] were partially or wholly responsible for the warm, slightly opaque yet relaxed, easy-going nature of these DACs?"
Sounds about right based on my experience with a couple NOS DACs. But here's my take on it. "These unsuppressed images were partially responsible for the warm, veiled, and dynamically challenged, almost lifeless nature of these DACs" ...... UNLESS one is playing 'simple music' like a female vocalist and piano. Play anything more complex and it all starts to fall apart sounding congested and compressed.
Edits: 11/17/23
The sample and hold is a filter of sorts but the conversions happen at the input sample rate so I think it fair to use the term NOS.
"The truth is, the bad rap about harshness with Delta Sigma designs probably lays more with a designer's poor implementation of the input and analog output stages of the DAC and less about the kind of chip used for the digital to audio conversion."I would have to agree with that.
And I would have to say that not all R2R / NOS DACs sound better. In my limited experience with two R2R DACs both were smooth and excellent with 'simple music' like a female vocalist and piano but they became 'congested' and lacked dynamics with more 'complex music'.
Edits: 11/16/23
Is this the legendary Abe Collins, after all these years? Good to see you are still caviling about something. Neal
Audiomaven
Yes it is I and Yes there's lots of petty differences of opinion in this audiophile hobby. Always has been.... which is probably true of any hobby.
| FAQ |
Post a Message! |
Forgot Password? |
|
||||||||||||||
|
||||||||||||||
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors:
Top of Page ]
[ Contact Us ]
[ Support/Wish List ]
[ Copyright © 2025, Audio Asylum, all rights reserved ]
